interview wayne rooney - david ornstein the athletic

Over the course of a captivating hour in the company of Wayne Rooney, we seem to cover nearly as many subjects as there are stars on the flag of the country that has become his adopted home.

It is not until reflecting on the life and times of the now 37-year-old that you appreciate how much he has experienced and can capably speak about — good and bad, on and off the football pitch, from England to the U.S.

This is the legendary former Manchester United striker who notched 253 goals in 559 games and won 12 major trophies, qualifying him to credibly discuss the club and its numerous talking points. That includes the Glazer family, Marcus Rashford, Harry Maguire and more.

This is the boyhood Everton fan, linked more than once to their managerial post and with strident feelings on the present state of affairs at Goodison Park.

Today he is the head coach of D.C. United, leading an improving team which has its eyes on a spot in the Major League Soccer play-offs while hoping to eventually manage at the highest level.

Having sampled both turf and touchline in MLS, Rooney is well placed to assess the status and Lionel Messi-inspired potential of the sport in the U.S heading towards the 2026 World Cup.

He is not afraid to advise Harry Kane on what he would recommend for the next chapter in the England captain’s career, nor broach topics like player conduct and Mason Greenwood’s future.

The Liverpudlian even lays claim to a son displaying early signs of following in his dad’s footsteps.

Sitting down at a hotel just a couple of blocks away from the White House, in the political heart of the U.S., a man familiar with representing the blues and reds is diplomatic and direct throughout a fascinating conversation.

Where better to start than Manchester United?

In a successful yet tumultuous 13 years at Old Trafford, Rooney was on the inside looking out. Since 2017, it has been the other way round — the record goalscorer observing events from afar. The intervening period saw United starved of success, only for Erik ten Hag to mark his maiden season at the helm by winning the League Cup in February and reaching the Champions League.

“There were huge improvements,” Rooney tells The Athletic. “Some really good signings and some good experienced players who helped the team. They’re competing with one of the best teams, probably, of all time in Man City. United are trying to get back challenging for the league title and I do believe they’re on the right path. There is a lot of work to be done but they are taking the right steps to do it.”

Rooney wants to see progress in areas such as the youth facilities and a winning mindset for every game and competition — “over the past 10 years they’ve come away from that a bit” — and the alterations, in his opinion, should extend to the Glazers bringing their ownership to a close.

“They have been very successful,” he says. “But it has probably got to a place where the fans really want a change. They want to maybe go in a different direction. It needs that excitement back, not just for the first team but to develop the academy and behind the scenes. I’m sure they will get the credit they deserve for the job they have done, but also they’re going to get the negativity from fans who never seem to acknowledge what they’ve done for the club.

“I’m sure it will be split, but I think a change is needed.”

On the ground, it is business as usual. Marcus Rashford has signed a fresh five-year contract and efforts continue to strengthen Ten Hag’s squad by adding a No 9 to spearhead the attack. “He is one of the parts of the jigsaw but also someone who could be the main man, the main player for Manchester United,” Rooney says of Rashford. “He had a fantastic season. The challenge for Marcus now is to do it for the next five, six, seven years and really take his legacy to a new level. Because he is a player who could quite easily go and break my goalscoring record.”

Rooney describes Harry Kane as the “ideal player” for United to recruit, but jokes that Tottenham Hotspur’s reluctance to sell makes it look like he has been “held as a prisoner” in north London. “I thought it was time to go last season and he stayed,” Rooney says. “Harry’s probably feeling that and knows there are trophies out there for him to win. He has done everything he can for that to try and be at Tottenham. Now probably is right for him to move on and it looks like he’s ready for that as well, but we know Tottenham can be quite difficult at times.”

When asked if there is somebody he identifies as an alternative, Rooney highlights Kylian Mbappe as the level of star United need to be able to target again if they are to compete for the biggest honours, even though he points out that it’s likely the Frenchman will be going to Real Madrid.

At the other opposite end of the field, David de Gea has left and Harry Maguire was recently stripped of the captaincy. De Gea’s low-key exit despite more than a decade’s service has attracted criticism in some quarters, though Rooney suggests it was “the right time” for the Spanish goalkeeper to go.

He is similarly clear on the situation of Maguire, an £80million recruit from Leicester City in 2019.“To have the armband taken off you, how does he move forward with the club?” Rooney says. “That shows the manager really doesn’t believe in him. It leaves Harry in a position where he has to think on what he does moving forward. The manager has shown he is not part of the plans. I’m sure Harry will want to go and play — for himself, for his England career — to put himself in the best position to be as successful as he can. The best thing now is probably for him to move.”

Rooney did not predict Maguire’s replacement, but views it as a chance to “bring more out of” someone in the way he did with Tom Lawrence at Derby County. Lawrence was made captain in 2021, two years after a drink-driving crash, giving an insight into Rooney’s progressive approach.

Rooney has committed mistakes and is by no means flawless. He was arrested for drink-driving in 2017 and a year later for public intoxication and use of public profanity in Washington D.C. But his personal journey offers him a recognition of the difficulties people often face in the industry — however the learning is ongoing.

A powerful interview with Dele Alli last week in which he opened up on sexual abuse as a child, living on the streets and an addiction to painkillers was eye-opening. “I have seen it first hand with players,” Rooney explains of the tablet addiction. “Sleeping tablets are a big problem. (But) Dele giving the interview he gave, maybe I’ll look guilty of judging him as a player and not understanding the full background and the story of where everything was.

“For young players now it can be a real tough place in terms of social media and the scrutiny that could come. You can make decisions and bad decisions, which can have a real impact on your life. And I’m sure there are a few more out there. The one thing I will say is that they’re in a society and a world now where help is there. So the more people who come out and do speak about their issues, the easier it will be for those people to try to get the help they need.”

One very complex case in UK football at the moment involves Mason Greenwood. The Manchester United forward remains unavailable for selection amid an internal investigation after the UK’s Crown Prosecution Service discontinued its case against him for attempted rape, assault and coercive control.

“For young players now it can be a real tough place in terms of social media and the scrutiny that could come. You can make decisions and bad decisions, which can have a real impact on your life. And I’m sure there are a few more out there. The one thing I will say is that they’re in a society and a world now where help is there. So the more people who come out and do speak about their issues, the easier it will be for those people to try to get the help they need.”

One very complex case in UK football at the moment involves Mason Greenwood. The Manchester United forward remains unavailable for selection amid an internal investigation after the UK’s Crown Prosecution Service discontinued its case against him for attempted rape, assault and coercive control.

For the time being, England can wait. There is plenty to achieve stateside. MLS is trying to grow and will expect Lionel Messi’s arrival at Inter Miami to have a transformational effect, especially with the World Cup looming and in light of the expanding Saudi Arabian Professional League.

Cristiano Ronaldo and Karim Benzema were among a wave of transfers to the Middle East and Messi stood to earn considerably more money by joining them. Instead, he chose MLS. “You can see how Saudi are trying to get certain players,” Rooney says. “So for MLS to get Messi was huge. How better to show it can compete with the Saudi riches than by getting Messi?

“The quality is very high in this league. It is probably a bit disrespected. You get agents phoning up and it’s almost an insult with some of the players you get offered — they’re nowhere near ready or good enough to play in the league.

“The excitement of getting Messi, Sergio Busquets, Jordi Alba and others who will come over, it brings attention. This league has all the capabilities of becoming one of the biggest leagues.”

Rooney’s bold assertion raises the age-old question of promotion and relegation, which is part of European soccer but not the U.S. league. He concedes this might be necessary if MLS is ever to be regarded alongside the Premier League, La Liga or Serie A, but knows it stands little chance of gaining the required approval from franchise owners. He can imagine the benefit of U.S-style salary caps in Europe, though also finds that conflicting. “I had it with Derby,” Rooney recalls. “Bad decisions put the future of the football club in doubt. We’ve seen it with many teams — Wigan, Bury — who could almost lose their identity and legacy. It gives more stability, but does it take the excitement away? You have to get the balance right.”


On the theme of possible regular-season Premier League or Champions League fixtures being staged in America, something often debated in European circles, Rooney is more unequivocal.

“Firstly you’re going away from your fans, which is obviously a huge part of the football club. If you’re putting on a final, it’s bad enough sometimes going down to Wembley and at the times the FA seem to be putting on games on. So to do it in a different country and the cost of that for the fans, the impact wouldn’t be great. There are so many different ways that you can make it (European football) available for people to watch, you’re probably better keeping it domestic.”

Speaking of domestic, there is a prospect on home soil who it would be remiss of us to ignore.

Rooney’s eldest boy Kai has set tongues wagging for his exploits in Manchester United’s youth system — and at 13 he is just three years younger than Wayne when he made his senior debut. “He’s enjoying it,” a smiling Rooney concludes. “That’s the most important thing. He’s doing everything he can to try to have a career in football and not just him, my other children as well.

“They love the game and my advice — to any children — is play to enjoy. There’s that much pressure when you do get to the professional level and sometimes you forget why you’re playing the game. You’re playing because you love playing the game and you enjoy playing the game. As long as you’re doing everything right to give yourself the best opportunity then you never know. Young players develop at different times and in different ways. He’s trying, he’s giving it a go and hopefully he can get to the level he wants.”